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Poster: light into ashes Date: Jul 24, 2010 9:06am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

I see these shows are TJI now....(though ironically, one already can't be displayed...)

I've also wondered about Rob Eaton & how he got the run of the Vault. Friend of Latvala's?

It's interesting that the Dead wanted to do 'matrix' recordings this early.....perhaps they felt the straight SBD's weren't cutting it as far as getting the live sound down. Seems to have been a short-lived experiment...since these were at the Carousel, both Bear & Healy would've been there.
It would be nice to hear more details about the mixing, the mic setup for these '68 recordings... We won't get it from Miller though, he's very closemouthed about his sources. "4-track" is about as much detail as he ever gives.

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Poster: Jim F Date: Jul 25, 2010 12:12am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

Personally I feel that these recordings should be listed as AUD's, partly because of the way they sound, but also for other reasons...

Anyway, I was alluding to Eaton earlier. Among all of us freaks there are so many names that get tossed around with great reverence: Miller, Latvala, Lemiuex, Walker, Cantor, Menke, Moore, Bertrando, Hohlwein, etc. (apologies to the many others instrumental in getting these tapes out). But Eaton is rarely among them. I find this somewhat ironic as his name is attached to just about everything that comes out nowdays. So many of Charlie Miller's transfers have "thanks to Rob Eaton for lending me his dats" in there somewhere. We know so much about the transfers of his tapes when they get into people like Charlie's hands, but next to nothing about how Eaton copied the masters, when, what equipment was used, etc. It's pretty well known that he was a taper back in the day and of course his involvement with DSO, but he seems to be a bit of a "man behind the curtain." The Latvala connection seems pretty obvious, esp as there are things like Charlie's comments in the 3/31 notes about "going with Dick's notes on DAT" regarding the date and such. He also thanks Eaton for lending him the dats on that one. I imagine for whatever reason Dick must have been feeding Eaton DATS on a regular basis, and one can only speculate on Dick's personal stash of tapes and what became of them when he died. But I guess we don't really need to know. It's probably best that people like Charlie keep pretty closemouthed about such things.

Anyway, these Carousel 68 tapes...yeah, I would love to know more about the masters, the mic setup, etc., but either way I don't care if we ever know as it's great to see fresh, crisp, professional transfers of these shows. 3/30 has long been a favorite of mine since obtaining it sometime in the 90's. The Dark Star, while still primitive, is a real gem, and as noted, is the longest known yet. The Other One sequence is great as well, but my favorite piece of the show is probably the Chinacat>Eleven. I think this was the first time I ever heard the pairing. I love any Eleven, and these earliest of versions are just as powerful as any of the latter versions.

I've had the 29th for some time as well, but it never got much play around here for some reason. While I know the show from the 30th like the back of my hand, I have little to no memory of the playing on the 29th. These new transfers, along with the previous post about the New Potato, gives me good reason to revisit the performance.

The 31st is such a short excerpt, but it makes for good filler when burning up any other early 68 show. I've always been a bit puzzled by the piece of Caution that we have, it clearly sounds like the end of the version on Anthem, but the quality on the album is different than found on the raw tapes. When looking for 68 tapes, Caution has always been the one that grabbed my attention when seeing it on a list, it is always unfortunate when you find out that it's very short or is missing a big chunk (which seems to happen quite a bit with Caution's, as they usually came late in the show and always seemed to have an unfortunate cut/reel flip during some crucial transition into the beginning of the song or conversely into feedback or something). It is a shame that the show is so chopped up and partial, I imagine we are probably missing a really great Alligator>Caution or Eleven>Caution. Maybe it's on some missing reel that wound up on the cutting room floor when the album was made and will turn up someday. HIGHLY unlikely, but us 67/68 freaks will never give up hope on these sorts of things.

At any rate, any and all music from 1968 has been, is, and always will be special treasures in my collection that we are very lucky to have. Had it not been for their crazy aspirations for the Anthem album, we might not have any of these Carousel shows. God bless Dan Healy. And Charlie Miller as well, for being so generous enough to share these nice sounding transfers of some classic era GD.

This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-25 07:03:29

This post was modified by Jim F on 2010-07-25 07:12:56

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Jul 25, 2010 11:08am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

3/29 is very nice (and longer now!), but it's more about individual songs than the seguefest of 3/30...even Dark Star just stops without segueing.

3/31 is a fuzzy date... Miller notes that the date and order of songs are uncertain - and he's opened up a can of worms by putting this same /Caution>feedback>Goodnight on 1/22/68 (per Dick's notes). But apparently even he's not sure which date this section belongs to. Before, I was saying aha, 1/22 is complete! - now I'm not too certain - maybe Dick was just guessing, and this is 3/31 after all.

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Poster: Jim F Date: Jul 26, 2010 12:36am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

I don't hear the 1/22 possibility myself, the "3/31" Caution sounds different from the other Jan-Feb recordings, and more importantly it sounds so much like these very distinct sounding mixes from the Carousel in March. And there is the other thought that Bid You Goodnight doesn't show up until mid-March, but with so many holes in 68 that could never be said to be fact. Anything is possible, though, I guess.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Jul 26, 2010 1:45am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

You know, I agree with you now... It fit so perfectly into the missing gap of 1/22, and it even came from the Miller source, but the evidence is against that date! Quite the goose-chase on my part.
One thing I noticed on checking it again, the mix changes in Caution - the drums become much more up-front at about 3:30 into Caution, a sure sign of a matrix mix. And as it happens, the Dancing in the Streets from 3/31 also has a huge mix change - the 'audience' sound disappears when they go into the solo, and it becomes a straight SBD. (For that matter, it was like that on the older 3/30 source too, but I hadn't noted it.)

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Poster: clementinescaboose Date: Jul 24, 2010 6:15pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: For you 1968 Freaks

micah6vs8 - that is nice to know, i feel i am a bit of a newb on here haha. to me, besides 72-74, the 68-69 era just can't be beat...i simply love everything about it :)